AFRIKA KORPS FORUM

Mon image

You are not logged in.

Announcement

New Forum about the DAK and Tropical German army, and Allied army in WW2 only

#1 21-02-2019 22:11:29

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

shoulder straps

Hi guys
here are a pair of shoulder straps.
Color of waffenfarbe is Copper Brown. (not so easy to see in the photos)
Please your opinions are very appreciated.
Thanks
Marco

https://i.postimg.cc/1t53T9v8/20190216-133935c.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/wT08fhSQ/20190216-134144.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/63gTGkhT/20190216-133959.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/qMdvVXDf/20190216-134132.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/MZ9dgdpH/20190216-134203.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/4NF2HwDq/20190216-134156.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/1XF0gcDh/20190216-134212.jpg

Offline

 

#2 22-02-2019 00:16:26

msteve21
Veteran DAK Member
From: Australia
Registered: 05-12-2011
Posts: 750

Re: shoulder straps

Hi Marco

I know there been mixed reviews about these on the WAF, most notably is the absence of the more knowledge tropical insignia collectors wanting to voice an opinion and the positive responses from European collectors many of whom have had little input tropical/DAK posts.

Personally I wouldn't buy these as there are several anomalies in the construction, for one the button hole stitching doesn't look as neat to the originals IMO, If you spending roughly a $1000 on boards then they might well be text book

Virtual and Hiscoll are good sources for original tropical shoulder boards.

Cheers
MSteve


Collector of DAK & Panzer Militia
Great Southern Land

Offline

 

#3 22-02-2019 01:10:54

Markus
Veteran DAK Member
From: Australia
Registered: 24-10-2014
Posts: 911

Re: shoulder straps

Hi Marco, I've also read the thread on the WAF about these straps.

I would be very careful about any tropical shoulder straps at the moment, because the quality of the high end reproductions in Europe is
getting very, very good.  You have obviously seen that there is a range of opinions on these straps and other tropical straps that have been posted
on the WAF in recent months.

IMO there are only a limited number of collectors who truly specialise in tropical shoulder boards; and are regular contributors to the
WAF and this forum.  I think you know who they are.    If you're not sure about this pair, I would carefully consider their opinions.

As msteve21 has pointed out if you're going to spend $1,000 or more on a set of these I'd be wanting to know the reputation and experience of
the seller regarding tropical shoulder straps and where did these come from - what is the provenance?  Is the price market value and what is the
refund policy?

Speaking more broadly on the topic of tropical straps it's obvious that the manufacturers of reproductions closely watch the WAF (and
maybe even forums such as this one).   You can guarantee they will be looking for feedback on what is wrong with their current efforts and
will incorporate changes to correct these in the next production run.   

Many of the high end repros coming out of Europe in recent months are for arms of service which are often missing from people's collections. The quality
is very high, constantly improving and likely to convince all but very experienced collectors that they are real. 

This is causing confusion and argument within the collector community about what is genuine and what is reproduction.  Therefore, how do you argue your
case for a refund if the collecting community itself is divided about what is a reproduction and what is not sad    Imagine trying to convince someone like eBay that
what you bought is a reproduction if the seller digs their heals in. 

IMO that is exactly what the fakers are seeking to do - create uncertainty and then snare collectors with an offer of a rarer branch of service at a lower
than market value price.  These straps are very rarely offered for sale at an affordable price and many don't even make it onto a dealer's website - this is
the bait.

I reckon this is spooking collectors and is IMO ruining this aspect of the hobby.  Some shoulder straps which are occasionally listed with dealers and would normally
sell within hours of being listed are now sitting there for over a week.  Below is an example and I'd be interested to hear what others think of these straps... why
haven't they sold? 

http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2587_2.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2587_2b.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2587_2c.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2587_2d.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2587_2e.jpg

Last edited by Markus (22-02-2019 13:58:47)

Offline

 

#4 22-02-2019 09:53:12

KeithTurner
DAK Member
From: Essex, UK
Registered: 26-07-2018
Posts: 65
Website

Re: shoulder straps

MSteve21 and Markus good advice and sensible argument...

Keith


I collect to the Long Range Desert Group, Indian Long Range Squadron and Popski's Private Army. Not just medals but photographs, documents, uniform, specialist equipment, badges etc. Anything considered..Keith

Offline

 

#5 22-02-2019 23:13:46

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

Many thanks mates.
I know very well what you are saying. sad
Marco

Offline

 

#6 03-03-2019 16:35:25

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

This is an interesting pair to observe. At first they looked ok to me but the more i closely examine the details the more i don't like them.

The colour looks more red on my screen rather than a copper brown. If the latter then it's a very rare waffenfarbe.

The stitching of the buttonholes is concerning me, that sharp edged grey wool and also the short piping.

Markus the pair you posted also doesn't look okto me. Especially the beige linen backing on one of them.


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#7 03-03-2019 23:45:03

Markus
Veteran DAK Member
From: Australia
Registered: 24-10-2014
Posts: 911

Re: shoulder straps

Thanks Chris, as you're probably aware the first set have been the subject of much debate on the WAF. 

I also have some concerns about the beige linen on the underside of the tongue of one of the Nachshub straps which I posted.

Regards Markus

Offline

 

#8 05-03-2019 10:01:20

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

This is an interesting pair to observe. At first they looked ok to me but the more i closely examine the details the more i don't like them.

The colour looks more red on my screen rather than a copper brown. If the latter then it's a very rare waffenfarbe.

The stitching of the buttonholes is concerning me, that sharp edged grey wool and also the short piping.

Markus the pair you posted also doesn't look okto me. Especially the beige linen backing on one of them.

Hi don

it's a pleasure to hear from you again. I returned here after a long period of my concentration on German continental uniforms.

Speaking about the shoulder straps I must say that the waffenfarbe is absolutely copper brown, the color in the pics is not correct.
As Markus said they have been the subject of much debate on the WAF.
However only 4 collectors were negative on them while 12 collectors, among these there are some very authoritative experts, were convincingly positive and 2 other gave an opinion closer to yes than no. So only a small minority of collectors judge these straps fakes!
Moreover some important guys confirmed to me that these straps come from a fortunately finding in a German factory in the 60s. Here there were hundreds of tropical straps of all the different waffenfarben, including the rare ones.
Another important point is that the straps has been proposed to me by one of the most authoritative and important Italian sellers, author of some books on the subject. Honestly I do not think he has any interest in ruining its reputation by proposing fakes. Obviously he gave me, as usually, a written life guarantee.
Made these premises I decided to buy a pair. However I did not buy those posted, actually I did not like the presence of a short piping. I bought instead a nice pair with a correct insertion of the piping and the classic shirt fabric lining on the tongue.
Ciao
Marco

Offline

 

#9 05-03-2019 18:42:26

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

zip3120 wrote:

don_kihotis7 wrote:

This is an interesting pair to observe. At first they looked ok to me but the more i closely examine the details the more i don't like them.

The colour looks more red on my screen rather than a copper brown. If the latter then it's a very rare waffenfarbe.

The stitching of the buttonholes is concerning me, that sharp edged grey wool and also the short piping.

Markus the pair you posted also doesn't look okto me. Especially the beige linen backing on one of them.

Hi don

Made these premises I decided to buy a pair. However I did not buy those posted, actually I did not like the presence of a short piping. I bought instead a nice pair with a correct insertion of the piping and the classic shirt fabric lining on the tongue.
Ciao
Marco

That sounds like a wise decision wink
IMO it doesn't matter how many voted yes and how many no. It's not a matter of democracy. What is important is WHO voted. There are less than 5 people that i would trust their opinions on tropical straps.


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#10 05-03-2019 18:43:53

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

Markus wrote:

Thanks Chris, as you're probably aware the first set have been the subject of much debate on the WAF. 

I also have some concerns about the beige linen on the underside of the tongue of one of the Nachshub straps which I posted.

Regards Markus

Hi Markus, actually i didn't. I rarely visit WAF but i will have to change that. I will look for it now.


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#11 05-03-2019 22:36:54

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

zip3120 wrote:

don_kihotis7 wrote:

This is an interesting pair to observe. At first they looked ok to me but the more i closely examine the details the more i don't like them.

The colour looks more red on my screen rather than a copper brown. If the latter then it's a very rare waffenfarbe.

The stitching of the buttonholes is concerning me, that sharp edged grey wool and also the short piping.

Markus the pair you posted also doesn't look okto me. Especially the beige linen backing on one of them.

Hi don

Made these premises I decided to buy a pair. However I did not buy those posted, actually I did not like the presence of a short piping. I bought instead a nice pair with a correct insertion of the piping and the classic shirt fabric lining on the tongue.
Ciao
Marco

That sounds like a wise decision wink
IMO it doesn't matter how many voted yes and how many no. It's not a matter of democracy. What is important is WHO voted. There are less than 5 people that i would trust their opinions on tropical straps.

Correct don but that 5 people I think you allude are almost all for yes....

Ciao
Marco

Offline

 

#12 06-03-2019 00:03:14

Markus
Veteran DAK Member
From: Australia
Registered: 24-10-2014
Posts: 911

Re: shoulder straps

Thanks for the additional information Marco, I hadn't heard about this large cache of tropical straps from the 60's before.

Hopefully when the new straps arrive you'll be able to post some pictures.

Regards Markus

Offline

 

#13 15-03-2019 11:35:24

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

IMO it doesn't matter how many voted yes and how many no. It's not a matter of democracy. What is important is WHO voted. There are less than 5 people that i would trust their opinions on tropical straps.

Completely agree my friend, I just wanted to say that the majority of learned collectors agree that they are good.

Meanwhile I have been talking to more than one expert collector here in Italy about the straps, having a good opinion. Same result obtained by a New Zealander collector, waf member, really expert on tropical shoulder straps.

Moreover Mark, in the waf thread, said: "I like them more than dislike."  and more: "Absolutely agree that these do not immediately shout 'Original!' but as Chris points out nicely, these could well be late manufacture...."

Antonio Scapini, with its knowledge and quality of his research, 100% confirms their originality.


As requested I post them, hoping that they will be judged in the absence of any prejudice.


Ciao
Marco


https://i.postimg.cc/dQ5H0776/a.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/rwJ8PCZc/b.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/Jntjvrbq/20190308-151946.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/CL7XyP0v/d1.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/L87yRGbV/e.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/Gh4Gr9wZ/h.jpg

https://i.postimg.cc/FsbdhSCC/l.jpg

Offline

 

#14 16-03-2019 11:34:01

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

zip3120 wrote:

don_kihotis7 wrote:

zip3120 wrote:


Hi don

That sounds like a wise decision wink
IMO it doesn't matter how many voted yes and how many no. It's not a matter of democracy. What is important is WHO voted. There are less than 5 people that i would trust their opinions on tropical straps.

Correct don but that 5 people I think you allude are almost all for yes....

Ciao
Marco

Have been away for some time but another good friend and member alerted me to this harmful thread.

Can entertain doubts to Marco's statement, But Chris can correct me on this ? Am thinking the five almost all cast no votes ?

Offline

 

#15 16-03-2019 11:58:35

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

Markus wrote:

Hi Marco, I've also read the thread on the WAF about these straps.

I would be very careful about any tropical shoulder straps at the moment, because the quality of the high end reproductions in Europe is
getting very, very good.  You have obviously seen that there is a range of opinions on these straps and other tropical straps that have been posted
on the WAF in recent months.

IMO there are only a limited number of collectors who truly specialise in tropical shoulder boards; and are regular contributors to the
WAF and this forum.  I think you know who they are.    If you're not sure about this pair, I would carefully consider their opinions.

As msteve21 has pointed out if you're going to spend $1,000 or more on a set of these I'd be wanting to know the reputation and experience of
the seller regarding tropical shoulder straps and where did these come from - what is the provenance?  Is the price market value and what is the
refund policy?

Speaking more broadly on the topic of tropical straps it's obvious that the manufacturers of reproductions closely watch the WAF (and
maybe even forums such as this one).   You can guarantee they will be looking for feedback on what is wrong with their current efforts and
will incorporate changes to correct these in the next production run.   

Many of the high end repros coming out of Europe in recent months are for arms of service which are often missing from people's collections. The quality
is very high, constantly improving and likely to convince all but very experienced collectors that they are real. 

This is causing confusion and argument within the collector community about what is genuine and what is reproduction.  Therefore, how do you argue your
case for a refund if the collecting community itself is divided about what is a reproduction and what is not sad    Imagine trying to convince someone like eBay that
what you bought is a reproduction if the seller digs their heals in. 

IMO that is exactly what the fakers are seeking to do - create uncertainty and then snare collectors with an offer of a rarer branch of service at a lower
than market value price.  These straps are very rarely offered for sale at an affordable price and many don't even make it onto a dealer's website - this is
the bait.

I reckon this is spooking collectors and is IMO ruining this aspect of the hobby.  Some shoulder straps which are occasionally listed with dealers and would normally
sell within hours of being listed are now sitting there for over a week.  Below is an example and I'd be interested to hear what others think of these straps... why
haven't they sold? 

http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/av … 2587_2.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/av … 587_2b.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/av … 587_2c.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/av … 587_2d.jpg


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/av … 587_2e.jpg

Agree, this is just spot on ! Brillant post Markus.

Everyone should read these words carefully as this is exactly the current situation imo.
The transport straps are fakes as well. Likely the same faker/maker as so many other recent fakes.

Offline

 

#16 16-03-2019 12:12:32

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

Hi Marco

Just a few corrections. The debate as to these straps being original was far from conclusive. Will not get drawn into another stupid argument again over this but needed to make sure those reading get the facts.

No one on the WAF that knows tropical straps said they are one look originals. The members that do like them are from Italy, same as the seller roll. and have never posted on any tropical straps thread on the WAF ever before....

What is this tropical strap cache found in a German factory that No-one has ever heard of ?  Hundreds of tropical straps including rare waffenfarbe? any proof ? All the collectors i asked have not heard of such a cache found ?

Antonio (the seller) has written a book on German tropical straps ? don't think so ? He can make mistakes too, just like any dealer.

A COA is just a worthless scrap of paper.

These straps will always be doubted by some collectors and are not one-look originals which is what is needed these days...

We can always agree to disagree on these straps my friend.

Ciao

Tim

Offline

 

#17 17-03-2019 11:57:20

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

The Magpie wrote:

Hi Marco

Just a few corrections. The debate as to these straps being original was far from conclusive. Will not get drawn into another stupid argument again over this but needed to make sure those reading get the facts.

No one on the WAF that knows tropical straps said they are one look originals. The members that do like them are from Italy, same as the seller roll. and have never posted on any tropical straps thread on the WAF ever before....

What is this tropical strap cache found in a German factory that No-one has ever heard of ?  Hundreds of tropical straps including rare waffenfarbe? any proof ? All the collectors i asked have not heard of such a cache found ?

Antonio (the seller) has written a book on German tropical straps ? don't think so ? He can make mistakes too, just like any dealer.

A COA is just a worthless scrap of paper.

These straps will always be doubted by some collectors and are not one-look originals which is what is needed these days...

We can always agree to disagree on these straps my friend.

Ciao

Tim

Hi Tim
as you well know it's always a pleasure for me to hear you...
Unfortunately this time we are not agree.
It is correct what you said about waf debate, it is far from conclusive.
I don't think that only "the one-look originals" are exclusively the only original ones! We know there were constructive changes with the passage of time, so late manufacture were not always identical to the first ones.
I also disagree with your statement that No one on the WAF that knows tropical straps said they are one look originals.
All the European, not only Italians, collectors (and two of them are very expert on subject) said yes at one look.
All the Italians (and among them I know very expert collectors, the fact that they don't often post on waf is not a discriminating factor) said yes at one look.
Two very competent New Zealander collectors said they are not one looker but they could be surely a late manufacture.
Only the Americans ones said no. (strange curiosity)

As for the finding I obviously have no proof, as indeed all of us have no proof of everything we have been taught by reading books, etc., but more than one collector told me about this. (I hope they haven't all been paid by the faker)

Antonio is not only a dealer, He is a great savant of the subject, the fact that he has not written books, among those he wrote, on tropical shoulder straps does not invalidate this.
Moreover, even those who gave a negative opinion on waf has never written books on this topic!

I think that currently collectors are so obsessed with fakes, that have actually flooded the market, to see fakes everywhere.
So let us keep a sense of proportion and make sure we do not throw the baby out with the bath water.

Ciao amico mio
Marco

Last edited by zip3120 (17-03-2019 16:09:31)

Offline

 

#18 19-03-2019 09:37:16

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

Hi Tim, welcome back cool

Marco thanks for posting photos from the other pair. Am i seeing a beige linen behind the tongues or is it because of too much light caught in the photo?


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#19 19-03-2019 09:39:19

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

Both pairs were made by the same hand, that's for sure. Note the sewing of the buttonhole, thread color, wool color and type.


http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_20190216-133959.jpg


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#20 19-03-2019 09:42:43

don_kihotis7
Moderator
From: Cyprus
Registered: 05-09-2013
Posts: 2578

Re: shoulder straps

The Magpie wrote:

What is this tropical strap cache found in a German factory that No-one has ever heard of ? 

Tim

That was indeed one of my initial thoughts. We all know the story of the beehive find but never heard of this factory find before.


_____________________
Back up forum in case of emergency: http://afrikakorpsforum.xooit.fr/index.php
German Helmet Walhalla: http://www.ghw2.com
http://afrikakorps.forumcrea.com/img/avatars/afrikakorps/big/2378_signature_photo.jpg

Offline

 

#21 20-03-2019 21:24:17

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

Marco thanks for posting photos from the other pair. Am i seeing a beige linen behind the tongues or is it because of too much light caught in the photo?

Hi don
thanks you for your reply.
No there is not a beige linen behind the tongues, it is a green brownish color, exactly the same of one of my dak shirt.

https://i.postimg.cc/ZYBfqgzj/20190320-203439.jpg


don_kihotis7 wrote:

Both pairs were made by the same hand, that's for sure. Note the sewing of the buttonhole, thread color, wool color and type.

Yes I think this too.


don_kihotis7 wrote:

The Magpie wrote:

What is this tropical strap cache found in a German factory that No-one has ever heard of ? 

Tim

That was indeed one of my initial thoughts. We all know the story of the beehive find but never heard of this factory find before.

I think it is very difficult for all collectors in the world to know all finding that happened in the past, perhaps this is possible for the most recent ones and closest, certainly not for those so ancient and far away.

However I don't think this topic is very important for us, even if more than one european collectors confirmed this to me.
I would like that critical points should be examined and listed for a friendly discussion. In fact I could to not post these shoulder straps and keep my convictions.
In this period I have evaluated many shoulder straps posted in this forum and in waf and I have not found significant differences.
As all of us are here for our fun and passion, only in this way we could all grow in our knowledge.

Ciao
Marco

Offline

 

#22 24-03-2019 09:11:51

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

This is an interesting pair to observe. At first they looked ok to me but the more i closely examine the details the more i don't like them.

The colour looks more red on my screen rather than a copper brown. If the latter then it's a very rare waffenfarbe.

The stitching of the buttonholes is concerning me, that sharp edged grey wool and also the short piping.

Markus the pair you posted also doesn't look okto me. Especially the beige linen backing on one of them.

Hi Chris

Thanks for the welcome & it's great to be back ! Hopefully can stick around and learn a few things tongue

Agree with these details which together just raise too many doubts. The piping actually looks like LW signals more than anything else...more on that in a few minutes. The straps Markus posted are fakes, & from a different modern faker/maker. The maker Markus mentions in his brilliant post #3.

Heia Safari !

t

Last edited by The Magpie (24-03-2019 09:12:37)

Offline

 

#23 24-03-2019 10:01:48

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

zip3120 wrote:

Hi Tim
as you well know it's always a pleasure for me to hear you...
Unfortunately this time we are not agree.
It is correct what you said about waf debate, it is far from conclusive.
I don't think that only "the one-look originals" are exclusively the only original ones! We know there were constructive changes with the passage of time, so late manufacture were not always identical to the first ones.


Great to hear from You my friend.

Your approach will only lead to a collection of original & questionable items, not one look originals. One look originals are the only straps that are excepted by everyone for +600euro. If there are doubts by many very long time tropical strap collectors from all over the world, then the straps in question are not worth keeping. When its time to sell...oh well.

One look originals are exactly what it takes days with the ability of the fakers in Germany.


I also disagree with your statement that No one on the WAF that knows tropical straps said they are one look originals.
All the European, not only Italians, collectors (and two of them are very expert on subject) said yes at one look.
All the Italians (and among them I know very expert collectors, the fact that they don't often post on waf is not a discriminating factor) said yes at one look.
Two very competent New Zealander collectors said they are not one looker but they could be surely a late manufacture. Only the Americans ones said no. (strange curiosity)


No one in the WAF thread said they were one look straps. Except the Italian members that have never posted on tropical straps before and their knowledge of tropical straps is not substantiated by having a history of posting on tropical straps. Unlike the members that did not like the straps that are some of the most advanced tropical strap collectors of the world such as OSS & pauke etc who all have an extensive proven history. Many Europeans do not like them either including a couple on this very thread, Chris & Markus. Other members that have not posted but have sent me an em from England also do not like them. Its not how many like the straps it's Who does and doesn't like the straps that really matter's....

Chris 90Lt and NZMark both seem unsure, some others from "down under" are also not convinced such as our esteemed member MarkS. So the entire world has some doubts my friend, not just the States.

You implied Antonio had written a book on tropical straps which he hasn't. Just another minor correction.
Maybe one day you will see my book
cool

Marco

We can disagree on these my friend is no problem or hard feelings whatsoever

caio

Tim

Last edited by The Magpie (24-03-2019 10:52:58)

Offline

 

#24 24-03-2019 10:19:07

The Magpie
Veteran DAK Member
Registered: 29-06-2011
Posts: 662

Re: shoulder straps

don_kihotis7 wrote:

The Magpie wrote:

What is this tropical strap cache found in a German factory that No-one has ever heard of ? 

Tim

That was indeed one of my initial thoughts. We all know the story of the beehive find but never heard of this factory find before.

Yes we know of the "beehive" cache find of tropical caps & equipment and other hordes found over the years such as Naples 2nd pattern tropenhelms and tunics or the tropical depot near Prague etc. But no longtime DAK collector i know (and they are the top of the list, a few are around here) has heard of a factory mint Herr tropical strap horde ever found post war ? Where are all these Herr minty tropical straps from the horde ? Why are they not all on dealers sights like the beehive caps from around the same time? roll

However there were two LW tropical factory mint strap hordes that have been found post war. These straps maybe could be from one of the LW tropical strap hordes as they look more like LW signals than anything else. They certainly are not Herr Recon straps....

Last edited by The Magpie (24-03-2019 11:04:33)

Offline

 

#25 24-03-2019 12:39:57

zip3120
Friend Of DAK Forum
Registered: 23-09-2015
Posts: 406

Re: shoulder straps

The Magpie wrote:

No one in the WAF thread said they were one look straps. Except the Italian members that have never posted on tropical straps before and their knowledge of tropical straps is not substantiated by having a history of posting on tropical straps. Unlike the members that did not like the straps that are some of the most advanced tropical strap collectors of the world such as OSS & pauke etc who all have an extensive proven history. Many Europeans do not like them either including a couple on this very thread, Chris & Markus. Other members that have not posted but have sent me an em from England also do not like them. Its not how many like the straps it's Who does and doesn't like the straps that really matter's....
Chris 90Lt and NZMark both seem unsure, some others from "down under" are also not convinced such as our esteemed member MarkS. So the entire world has some doubts my friend, not just the States.

Tim everyone want to see what he thinks is right for him... however, everyone can read in person what is written in the waf thread.

Antifake
RobertE
joachim42
Militaria-Roman
LineaGotica
axismilitariafb
GAMS1
Stive
MarcoPennisi
AlexCiavaglia    said Yes at one shot! (Here we can find some most advanced strap collectors and the two last Italians are authors of many publications in Italy)

NZMark
90th Light  are more positve than negative (read carefully what they said). 90th Light moreover confirmed to me by email that he personally believes very much in them.

Pauke
OSS
Galizien41
and you     are negative at one shot!

Tim, I am agree with Don, this is not a democracy, however this fail what you said. Many collectors said yes at one shot and the majority of most advanced strap collectors are positive or only with some doubt.
Everyone is free to draw his favorite considerations.
Having said that I would prefer to not continue the discussion on waf thread any more, which risks becoming absolutely boring. On the contrary I am open to start having a constructive comparison on what you don't like or like about these shoulder straps, according to my original intent.

The Magpie wrote:

The piping actually looks like LW signals more than anything else...more on that in a few minutes.

absolutely wrong...
Here you can see the differences.
Second and third straps have been judged on waf unanimously, including the leading experts, absolutely original.
As we can see the Heer tropical and continental copper brown piped are absolutely identical in color and they are brighter and more reddish than the more brownish LW.

https://i.postimg.cc/kXg1YPZS/20190324-121537.jpg

Ciao
Marco

Last edited by zip3120 (24-03-2019 23:22:20)

Offline

 

Board footer

Créez Votre Propre Forum
Insérer vos Graphiques
Dictionnaires de Traduction
Hébergé par ForumCrea.com